Solar System Synchronicities

My name is Roger Tattersall and I am proud to have been invited by Ray Tomes to join this forum. My interest in cycles is primarily in studying the solar system and the relationship between it’s cyclic motions and cycles in Earth’s climate and other varying terrestrial phenomena such as the length of day.

My interest in the subject was sharpened when I read Ray’s thread on another forum concerning the link between planetary motion and the sunspot cycle. On that thread, Ray was assisted by some posts made by Vale Carl Smith, who had been studying the motion and angular momentum of the sun relative to the centre of mass of the solar system, or ‘barycentre’ (SSB). The solar motion relative to the SSB can be regarded as a proxy for the aggregate of planetary motions in the solar system.

Today is the first anniversary of Carl’s death and while his loss caused sadness for all who knew him when he lost his battle with cancer, his wish that his work be carried forward and extended is one which is fulfilled today by several people including Geoff Sharp, who continues Carl’s blog at and augments it at a new site I have also used Carl’s insights to further my efforts at my own blog

Anniversaries are important, they remind us we made it round the sun again! In Carl’s memory today, I’d like to open discussion of the fascinating longer cyclicities evident in the solar system’s exchanges of angular momentum by posting two graphs produced by Carl of the suns angular momentum relative to it’s motion around the solar system barycentre. The first gives a 6000 year broad sweep overview of the long term cycles:



The second gives a closer view of the last 400 years, and hints at the interesting self similarity of successive ~180 year periods.



It was Carl’s belief that these repeating periods coincided with the major climate events in our history as well as the solar grand minima. We may be entering one now, as the Sun is very coy about getting solar cycle 24 under way properly after a long minimum.  Carl’s work has never been more relevant.


About tallbloke

I study climate and weather for interest, And drive at high speed just for kicks, The solar system's my playground, Sunshine and rain my fix.
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5 Responses to Solar System Synchronicities

  1. Roger, welcome! It is great to have someone who is able to look at other people’s research and test it out to see whether it stands up or not.

    I agree that Geoff Sharp does interesting work. When I gave my first conference presentation at FSC Landscheidt disagreed with me when I said that the long term outer planet was 171 years (the U-N synodic period) and that 179 years was just what I called a “specific occurrence” and that sometimes a 159 year cycle has be inserted to keep Uranus and Neptune in alignment. Both these periods are multiples of 19.86 years, the Jupiter-Saturn conjunction period. When I put this as a comment on the Landscheidt site, Geoff agreed with it.

    I want to mention one thing in the history of this idea. In Jose’s paper he has a graph showing how the solar cycle fits the outer planets cycle. He achieved this by reversing alternate sunspot cycles, a perfectly acceptable procedure as the N-S polarity does reverse each cycle. However at one point he did not reverse the cycle. In this way he made what is really a true 22.15 year cycle look like it matched the Jupiter-Saturn period of 19.86 years, which of course it does not and never can. Frankly I am amazed that this was allowed into a peer reviewed journal.

    Much of this is covered in the page:

    I have done some analysis of that 11000 year C14 record, and will make a new post on that subject.

  2. tallbloke says:

    Ray, thanks for your comments. I hadn’t been aware of Jose’s error/fudge until now. The Suess/de Vries cycle around 205yrs is worth thinking about, as we are around 200 years on from the Dalton Minimum in solar activity.

    • Ray Tomes says:

      The best fit of the sunspot cycle at some lag is 211 years. Of course it has to be a multiple of 11.1 years and 11.1 years x 19 = 210.9 years. I will perhaps do a post showing this.

  3. Ulric Lyons says:

    Hi Ray and Rog,
    37370 and 74740 days would be my target, due to inner strong planet harmonies including Ceres, a good J/N harmony, and close to 6 x the 17yr solar cycle.

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